The Most Expensive Mistakes in Business

Ever feel like you returned from a “break” only to land in the same loop of emails, invoices, and small fires? We dig into the real shift that breaks that cycle: stop operating, start leading. This conversation pulls apart what it takes to step into a true CEO role—hiring a strong second-in-command, enforcing standards that protect your cash flow, and designing systems your team actually uses every day.

We get honest about the biggest mistakes across ten years in business. Ignoring brand early cost years of compounding attention. Trying to learn everything alone bled time and money that a great mentor could have saved. Hiring cheap created expensive headaches; hiring senior talent bought back time, trust, and momentum. And the costliest lesson of all: being lenient on client payments. We share the exact practices that fixed it—clear expectations at contract signing, strict late fees, and zero-blur lines between friendly and friends.

From there, we zoom in on systems and compliance. It’s not enough to document processes; you have to remove ambiguity. Use precise timing, clear outcomes, and visual instructions so there’s no room to drift. Ask yourself: if my life depended on this task getting done, what would I provide? That mindset changes adoption, quality, and pace. We also question whether it’s smarter to buy a business with working systems rather than building from scratch, and why real-world learning beats academic theory for practical performance.

If you’re ready to stop reliving the same 12 months, this is your playbook: set standards, enforce payments, hire for excellence, and buy back your time so you can grow brand, pipeline, and opportunities that scale. Business becomes a vehicle for personal growth when you choose excellence over busyness and design a company that moves. Subscribe, share this with a friend who needs the push, and if you’re in construction, message us for the free ticket link to the Builder Summit on February 25 in Melbourne. Your next level starts with one decision—what will you change today?

Chapters

• 0:00 Falling Back Into Old Habits
• 0:50 Road Trip Reset And Investment Goals
• 2:20 Deep Work, Email Boundaries, And Refresh
• 4:25 Leads, Follow-Ups, And Shaking The Machine
• 5:20 What The Business Lacks: Strong 2IC
• 7:40 Moving To CEO Mode And Hiring Plan
• 9:20 Ten Years In: Brand, Mentors, Mindset
• 13:10 Pay For Talent, Buy Time, Build Trust
• 15:00 Changing The Game And Avoiding Groundhog Day
• 18:30 Systems, PM Tools, And Real Adoption
• 22:00 Tight Standards, No Wiggle Room
• 24:00 Why Leave Anything To Chance
• 26:40 Start-Up Versus Buy A Business
• 29:00 What Uni Missed: Learn By Doing
• 32:40 Biggest Lesson: Enforce Payments Relentlessly
• 36:10 Contracts, Accountability, And Walking Away
• 39:20 Delegation, Systems Compliance, And Culture
• 42:20 Business As Personal Development Vehicle
• 45:00 Write The Book And Final CTA: Builder Summit

Transcript

Robby: 0:00

Do you feel like you're falling back into the same like habits and like the same grind?

George: 0:08

Yeah, it's very funny that you mentioned that right now because I felt like that the last three days.

Robby: 0:13

Yeah, you know what? I saw it on you.

George: 0:15

Yeah. I felt it the other I just got in the office. I'm like, what the fuck's going on? You know, why what what's why what's changed from I felt like I haven't left. I've been all around the fucking world and I felt like I haven't left the spot. Ed came back to the same fucking problems. Same, the same shit. And I'm like, why? This isn't right. And then I'm like, okay, end of the week. Then it'll be better. Hey, that's the same fucking shit.

Robby: 0:39

That's yeah, that's that's that's 2025, George.

George: 0:42

It was. And I was speaking, I went for a cruise with my old man today down to Geelong, Geelong, uh, looking at a project down there.

Robby: 0:50

Oh, yeah.

George: 0:51

Yeah, yeah, out of the norm. Very it's uh a church, actually, not a new one, but like retrofitting stuff. But went down there, it was a good hour's drive. It's actually exactly an hour drive from here to there to where this site was, had a look at it. But it's good because it was fine. Yeah, it's fine. It actually happened quite a bit. It was actually quite quickly. Yeah, yeah. And like the time went by quickly. And anyway, we got speaking about stuff, and it's like we were, yeah, we spoke a little bit about work. This is happening, this is coming in, this is there, that's there, this is happening with these jobs and whatnot. But the conversation shifted from work to then okay, started talking about investments and started talking about, hey, you need to start looking at this, you need to start looking at that. I'm like, yeah, and then we start talking more in depth about options and shares and all this sort of stuff. So I'm like, okay, good. That that was one of the things. That's one of my goals that I wanted to speak about. Oh, sorry, that I'm I've put down for myself this year is making a significant investment, but also diversifying my portfolio as well. So that is going to be a core strategy of mine this year. And I've given myself, in all honesty, like saying what we're that whole same thing, we're back in the in the in the ruts. I've given myself this week to do the shits and bits that needed to be done because there's always little bits and pieces that have to be done. All right, totally fine. So I've given myself this week and then next week I've already gone, all right, on these days these things are happening, these things are changing. So um yeah, how about you?

Robby: 2:20

Do I feel like I'm back in the I don't I do feel uh I feel refreshed. Good.

George: 2:28

Yeah, and you didn't really take time off either.

Robby: 2:30

Nah, but I I what I did so dude the other day, I I reckon the most satisfying thing in the world, like the thing that fuels me more than anything, is getting shit done. You know, like the other day I worked, I I was here at like quarter to five and I was probably here till 9 pm. I had lunch here, dinner here, like I was just working and just getting stuff done. And at the end, I went home and I wasn't tired. Yeah, I was thriving from how much shit I got done. You know how much shit I got done that day? Like I had a day where like hardly got interrupted, and I was just doing all the shit that I've been needing to do. And yeah, I thrived from that. Yeah, and I got to do that during the break massively because many people are bothering me. Everyone was away. My phone did not ring until the 5th of January.

George: 3:25

So good. That is so good.

Robby: 3:26

Yeah, and it's like I was just like banging things out, banging things out, banging things out, banging things out, and um it's like it's it's almost like I had a break.

George: 3:34

No, who would have thought? Who would have thought? And that that's probably one thing I did this year that I haven't done previous years. I didn't really check my emails. So that was kind of I was happy about that whilst I was there, because I've gone all around the world, went to LA, then came back for a few days, and off to Noosa. And so I've had a really good break, and I didn't really check my emails too much. I did a bit of work here and there, but sort of stayed away from it, kept it at arm's length, go, no, I'm just gonna relax, I'm gonna do my own thing.

Robby: 3:59

You don't have your emails on your phone, yeah.

George: 4:00

But I never check it. I never check it. Like I don't have notifications that come up, I've turned them all off.

Robby: 4:05

But you don't open it and very rarely.

George: 4:07

Really?

Robby: 4:07

Wow. Fuck, I check mine way too much.

George: 4:09

Oh, I see. I hate that I hate that. That shits me up the wall. So I I don't look at them much at all. Unless it's something pressing or urgent that I need to do, yeah, absolutely I will. But I prefer to look at them on the PC anyway, or a laptop, or an iPad or something because it's just bigger and easier to navigate. But yeah, I didn't do that too much, which was good. So I still feel like I've had a good break and feel refreshed. It's just day one back in the office. I'm like, same shit, same stuff that was doing. No, no, well, what's going on with this? What's going on with that? So I did spend a bit of time yesterday actually going through past inquiries and leads and a few things, and I was like noted down some people to call, some um architects that we've worked with, some clients just for uh uh potential work coming in and going out. Uh so I will follow those up probably on Friday. I've scheduled some time to do that. But yeah, it's it's a matter of now let's let's really start to shake this machine because it's been working for 10 years and it's got everything that it needs to be huge and successful and and really well uh just a mover and shaker in the space, but things need to be propelled in that direction and not to be doing the same old stuff every single day.

Robby: 5:19

If you this is just a random question. No, that's all right. But if you had to say like your business lacked one thing, what would it be? Because I think you've got a pretty strong brand.

George: 5:33

Yeah, I think so too. It's funny, like a lot of people do mention that um just from they know of the brand, they know of what we're doing. And we've been around for 10 years now, so it's a decent amount of time and people have seen our projects around.

Robby: 5:44

It's also a good name, like cutting name. Yeah, isn't that fun?

George: 5:48

Yeah, yeah, it is, it is. Uh it's not I don't think it's overly original, but it's yeah, it does the it does the it does it well. What's it lacking at the moment?

Robby: 6:01

It's a great question.

George: 6:02

It is, it is. It really makes you think about well, okay, you know what's good, well what's not a hundred percent. What's the thing that's gonna change things around a little bit? Yeah. I my old man has retired fully, yeah, pretty much. Like he he goes to sites in the morning and just looks at stuff, and I think that's more just out of boredom than anything else, and speaks to the boys and they'll ask him some questions here and there. But you know, that knowledge that he has is very, very difficult to replace. Now I've got a a lot of well, the guys I've got working for me know their stuff and and they're good at what they do, but there's still an element of going, all right, he understands, he knows how to. I had I never questioned when he was running all the jobs if the projects were being pushed. Like I never called up and said, hey, where's the carpenter? Where's this? I just knew he ran a tight ship and I knew things would be getting done as they needed to get done. Whereas now it's like, okay, is that element lacking? It's very early. Like I've now got a new GM, he's coming on site. He's he hasn't been in the office once this year already. He's been on site the whole time. So I know he's taking care of that and I'm seeing that. So this is probably me just letting that ship run its course a little bit and giving him the support. But um having that once I know and have full confidence that he's got that under control, I'll feel a bit better. So it's not that it's lacking, I just want to make sure that that is working and that part of the machine is working. And then, you know, for me, this year is gonna have a pretty strong emphasis on me stepping back from doing the day-to-day operational stuff, like any processing of invoices, like contracts, that sort of stuff.

Robby: 7:41

Yeah.

George: 7:42

I I really want to be the CEO. You know, I don't think I've been that CEO since I've been in the CEO role, funny enough, which is effectively last year.

SPEAKER_01: 7:53

Yeah, okay.

George: 7:55

Um so that comes down to people. So I I think it's more a person or people type thing. But you know, once we as I said, I've said multiple times we've priced a very large project and you know, we're still in the box seat to win it. Uh we secure that job and put pen to paper, I will go out and employ one to at least three people from a management point of view. Uh two management, one site type person. Like as in um either leading hand or labour type person. Gonna need a new office. Yeah, yeah, well, good. Good, let's go.

Robby: 8:30

Um yeah, that's good. That's great. Um what so you've been in business for ten years now? Ten years. I know, man.

George: 8:40

Going quick, huh?

Robby: 8:41

I don't know. You tell you. Uh looking back at your journey, what would be what would be some of the biggest things? You know how like you look at you know what I do every year? I tell you this, every single time I get to the start. We've just moved project management systems. Yeah. Pain in the arts. Fuck, it was a pain in the ass. Still not done, but like 90% done. Yeah, okay. And it's like very very job to do. Yeah. And we've just moved project management systems, and now we're on the other side, and I've got this new tool, and it's a great tool, and we're able to do things we weren't able to do before, and we can see capacity, and we can do all this other stuff and and reporting, and it's great. Purely for a project management aspect. Like we've got now our our timelines have Gantt charts, and we didn't have that before. Uh so it's really cool like that.

George: 9:34

Yeah.

Robby: 9:35

But I I I look at now, and I remember thinking this the other day, and I was like, but I thought I had systems before. Now, now we've got some tight systems. But I think that every single year. Do you know what I mean? And I look back to the start of last year, and I thought the same thing. Thought I had systems before, now, like, you know, I've made all these scripts and I've got all this other jazz.

SPEAKER_01: 10:01

Yeah.

Robby: 10:01

And don't get me wrong, it all keeps compounding. You know, and now it's like we've got all these different systems, and it's really good. But I constantly look back and think I knew at points I thought I know a lot, I look back now and think poor bloke. Poor, poor guy. Poor. Um and I imagine that happens a lot of times across a 10-year span. I haven't been in business for 10 years. And I'd imagine it happens a lot in that window.

George: 10:33

The very first thing I would say that I didn't concentrate on at all for probably two years at least was brand. Didn't didn't do shit for it at all. Now it's like had I had the mindset and mentality of myself today, back then, I would have I'd probably have a million followers. You know, because the the amount of content that we put out today, the amount of videos we make, the stuff that we do, it's it's very engaging from that perspective. But imagine it back then when you really have organic reach, when you have people's attention will come to you at hardly anything as far as cost is concerned. It's just the cost of entry was putting out the content. So that was probably my very first mistake. Well, not mistake, a lack thing that lacked in the business. I didn't invest in any of that. And people wouldn't think that seeing me today. People think, oh, look at, you know, they might think that I'm uh egomaniac or just self-absorbed and want to do heaps of content, love being in front of camera on stages. Well, I've never been like that. I've never wanted to just like I'd rather just do the work and don't talk to me and that's it. I don't want to post anything. But that was a mistake, thinking like that. So that was my very first thing that I reckon I'd stuffed up on. The next thing again was uh probably I'd say in around year three, was starting to. I I was probably a bit arrogant at the beginning of my business, thinking I'm so good, I can build everything, I'm the best, I'm no one can touch me, making some good money. But I had a leaking bucket in certain areas of the business. Like I didn't know, I didn't have I had some employees, but I didn't really have that right person in the role as far as the admin staff or all the systems to manage that person or people, multiple people. So I think me even just getting advice from someone that's done it before, either a mentor or another builder or like a builder that actually knows their stuff, not just on the tools, I'd say that was another mistake too. That cost me time and money because I thought, oh, I can do this myself. I can learn it all by myself. And I'm sure I would have. I'm sure I would have learned it all myself. Yeah, you you pay the price. You pay the price, either way. Time or money. I think I would have liked to, but even then, like I I was probably less, I was less willing to spend money to get the lesson. Whereas now I'd be like, like, yeah, let's how much, how much time are you gonna save me? Let's go. I see the huge value and the uplift in connecting with the right person to give me that knowledge base to excel in the direction that I want to go in. So that's a definitely a huge mindset shift. But it was also I needed to get out of my own way. You know, A, I thought I was really good, but B, I was a tight ass and didn't want to spend the money on what 10 grand on doing a course. Like, fuck that. I can just learn it myself.

Robby: 13:13

Yeah.

George: 13:14

Um, so that was that was another thing. And it wasn't until I started to get into that personal development space, that business management space, that I started to learn and then, you know, started to follow people like Gary V and Grand Cardone and then Tony Robbins and a whole range of people there that and read, like I never read anything ever. And you know, from the time I finished high school to starting my own business, man, I probably the last book I read was in high school. You know what I mean? It wasn't anything that I did. Whereas now, like I went to the airport when I got back from Noosa last week, and I was at one of the shops and I found a book. I'm like, oh cool, I'm gonna buy that. And I read half the book on on the plane on the way back, so it's like there that's a huge that was a huge shift in mindset for me for sure. Uh another thing. What book did you buy? Uh Reasons. No, was it I've got it on my desk. It's um I think it's Reasons Not to Worry or something like that. I'll I'll find out. Yeah, okay. An Australian author. Um I'll I'll find out. But yeah, it was it it it was it had a very bought a book from the airport. Yeah, but it was very fucking I had an hour and a half to kill waiting for the plane. But it was uh it's got a strong emphasis around stoic stoicism. So that's kind of and I've got an interest in that, so I uh I followed I I got the book and started reading it. Greek mythology, huh? Is it isn't it Roman? I think it is, it's Greco-Roman something, whatever. Tomato, tomato, tomato, tomato. That's exactly right.

Robby: 14:50

That's a the Roman emperor who spoke Greek. Yeah, whatever.

George: 14:54

Whatever, they're all Greek. They're all Greek.

Robby: 14:56

Um yeah, okay, interesting.

George: 14:58

Yeah, and then I I suppose another little one as well is Well, look, let's not talk about the little ones. No, it's a decent one. Okay. It's decent in the sense of I employed someone, but it's like I would go out and look for who was the cheapest employee I could find for a role. Or let's go get the grad. I'll pay him 30, 40, 50 grand, whatever it is, but like let's get that entry-level person that I don't have to pay anything. Whereas now I look at that and going, cool, how much can I afford to pay someone? What is the most I could pay someone to do this role and take absolute control of the project or that role or that position? Because now again, I see the value in time, I see the value in expertise, I see the value in me being able to go away and for him to be able to do that. Imagine I could have someone here doing everything I do and then I just do build or elite and I come in on a boardroom meeting every month. You know, that would be fantastic. But in order for me to do that, I need to pay for it. I need to have the right people with the right skills, I need to have the trust there. So I'm I'm definitely, even though I feel like I'm in that this first few days, they've been back for three days now. I feel like it's just been the same mundane stuff that I've been doing over the last 20, 25. There is still the strategy and the game plan there to go, all right, things are gonna be different this year. They have to be. I need to challenge myself. Otherwise, because I don't want to do this for another 10 years.

Robby: 16:14

I don't want to say you don't want to live, you don't want to live the same 12 months again.

George: 16:18

No, without a doubt. Without a doubt, you know, and I was looking at like think about guys, you're listening to this podcast. 90% of people that were listening to this had a holiday of some sort over the Christmas break. No matter what industry you're in. Most people will take a week, two weeks, if you're lucky, three or four weeks. You're already back at work. It's nearly the end of January. Like that, like blinked, and it's over. I remember the coming into I remember the last week of of the year, last year, going, holy shit, I'm going to LA on Friday.

Robby: 16:47

So has it been, have you felt like it's gone super quick?

George: 16:49

Yeah, I have. You have? Yeah, but I've done so much in the last three, four weeks. So I I haven't stopped. Like there hasn't been a day. Um couple days where we came back to Melbourne before we went to Noosa. But yeah, so I felt because we've been non-stop the whole time, there was that element of it too. But yeah, dude, it feels really like it went really, really quick this year, the holiday period.

Robby: 17:08

Yeah, okay. Interesting. I feel like I feel like it's been 2026 for nine months.

George: 17:13

Yeah.

unknown: 17:14

Yeah.

Robby: 17:14

Well, you haven't really you haven't taken much time off.

George: 17:17

Yeah, you've been here. And and look, there's an element of that which is great too, because I've had days where you know no one calls you, no one bothers you, no one does anything, and it's just like, wow, this is amazing. Like working on a public holiday, you know, it's the same thing. No one's gonna call you, all your employees at home or doing what they're gonna do.

Robby: 17:33

Uninterrupted work.

George: 17:34

Yeah, it's uninterrupted work. I could turn the music up as loud as I want, I can walk around with my top off, like whatever. So you do so you don't coming in next time. I've still but you know, like there's one thing I've I've taken my training really seriously the last three weeks that I've been in this year, and it's good. Like I'm feeling strong, I'm feeling confident again, and got this the rate, the regime is set there. We've got actual dates and targets and goals and everything that we're doing with the diets, with the exercise. So that's gonna be a great shift and change in in what I'm doing. But also living into really leaning into my core belief of excellence, and that's what's gonna push me and drive me this year is wanting to like having that high standard for myself of being the best. Well, so cool, man. The best don't process fucking invoices, the best don't come in and write contracts or negotiate this or do that. They go out there and they make it happen and they execute. I think I remember what I was gonna say. I was watching a video yesterday. So, you know, Matt Armstrong, I've spoken to you, he's the guy that's on YouTube and fixes cars and all that sort of stuff. So there was this guy in America that bought a Bugatti. He crashed it, and he was going back and forth with Bugatti to fix his car, and they're like, No, we'll quote they quoted him like 1.7 million to fix the car, all right? Because he's crashed the front of it. He's like, that's bullshit, I'm not paying that, blah, blah, blah. No insurance? No, he's got insurance, he's got insurance. But hear this out. All right. So he then got paid out by the insurance company. Okay. So what happened is that goes on to an auction site as a crash-damaged car. It's repairable because it is, but it had a$1.7 million price on it for it to be repaired. This guy then got paid out by insurance, then went online and bought his same car back, crash damage. And then he called Matt Armstrong. He lives in the States, he called Matt Armstrong, and Matt Armstrong has gone across now to the States and he's fixing this car. Now, Bugatti won't sell him parts because they don't want him to fix the car. They don't want to debt, they don't want it to be detrimental to their brand that anyone can fix a Bugatti. It's only them that can do it, which I completely kind of agree with from a brand perspective. They're trying to protect their brand and what they're about, and they're the most expensive car in the world and all this sort of shit, that only our technicians can build it, no one else. And he's like, nah, fuck you. I'm gonna build this car, I'm gonna do everything, I'm gonna 3D print parts if you don't sell them to me. Like he's going full on. But aside from From that, it was like this bloke bought a five million dollar car, he then crashed it, he then bought the car back to fix it, just to say fuck you to Bigatti, and now he's documenting that whole process. And mind you, it was it was one of 30 supercars he had on his mansion home and all this sort of shit. And it's just like, okay, I was watching that video, and whilst it was very entertaining watching it and seeing them go through that process, the other side of it was like, look at what he's doing, look at what position he's put himself in as a 25-year-old, mind you. He's 25. 25. I'll send you the link. I'll send you the link. It's very interesting. 25 years old. And he's doing all of these things. He's got one of 30 supercars. He's now going and he's he's employing Matt Armstrong. He's probably paying Matt a million bucks to come in just fucking create. Who is he? I think he's a trader of some sort, whether it's in crypto or or um stocks. Something stocks. He does something along those lines. But regardless, he's made a lot of money and he's self-made. Self-made. Yeah, yeah. I'll find out the guy's name later.

Robby: 21:03

But that that's you know, I um just on that, like I feel like that's a really it's a bad narrative with what to set to have an expectation of having all this jazz by uh 20 years old. Oh yeah, without a doubt. It is so rare. Like so rare. Oh, without a doubt. You know what I mean? There would be you could count the people that could do that in the country on on one hand, probably. But to be to be self-made, just to be clear. Like if you're entering uh good question. Do you think your kids come and work for you?

George: 21:53

Would they come or would I want them to your son specifically? I guess. Would I would I want them to? Or what's the question? Both.

Robby: 22:02

Will they and would you want them to?

unknown: 22:05

I don't know.

Robby: 22:08

Not now.

George: 22:08

No, it's obviously I'm saying it's early in the sense of I don't know what their in where their interests are going to lie. I don't foresee my daughter doing that at all. She's not she's more of a creative type person, so I don't see her going down that path. My son, more so, potentially. He he's got that uh he's cluey, but also I don't think he shies away from saying doing hard work if he needs to.

Robby: 22:29

Yeah, but don't you think so? Don't you think that if he took that path, and maybe this is just a weak part. I know what you're saying, yeah. He you he is gonna get opportunities that no one else is.

George: 22:40

Yes. That's just the reality. Is it also an aspect of potentially his almost is also being limited because he'll be coming here it's like in the sense of I know what I know, is he gonna ever know something else?

Robby: 22:55

Yeah, but he could get his first three years done here and then go somewhere else. Yeah. If that's it. Absolutely. Yes, he could. Yeah. Um yeah, I just I find it you think you almost think that that's the way it's supposed to be. You're like, fuck, man, 25 and don't have all this fucking shit together. Yeah. I think it's it's a very bad. It's unrealistic. Is what I'm trying to say.

George: 23:22

Alex Gonzalez. That's him. So yes, I think you're right. There is a let there is a level at. But it's still also there are people that's not to say, okay, I need to be some have hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars, and uh, and because I don't, I'm a failure, but it just does go to show that there's people out there that are doing bigger things, and there is the abundance, and there are bigger things out there that you could be doing. Just because I'm a builder, just because I'm doing things this way, doesn't mean this is the way they have to be done. That's all it was for me. It was that reminder to go, okay, something can be different here because out there there's a builder that turns over$100 million. There's a builder out there that's doing a single project that's a hundred million dollars. Now, what does it take? Is that the game? Is that me going, all right, do I need to be at that hundred million dollars? Or do I need to diversify? Do I need to be doing more developments? Do I need it like what's that game? So it just makes me think a little bit more. And what is it? What's the game? I just the game needs, I think it just needs to change, not drastically, just things need to be done differently. And that's potent that's part of the reason why I really want to step back from being the operator of the business. And just give it a crack. Like, what's the worst that's gonna happen? I have to step back and be an operator. Like, all right, fuck it. It is what it is, but at least I'm gonna give it a fair nudge. And the person now in my new GM Simon that I'm putting into place, well, he's got the skill set, he's been here long enough, he knows what he needs to do, he's driven enough. I'll guide him, I'll coach him, I'll train him in areas that he's lacking. But if I can have that person and I trust him as well, that can go and grab the the bull with both horns and actually, okay, I'm gonna take this, I'm gonna operate it, George, don't worry about it. That's massive for me. So that's where should this have happened two years ago? Maybe. I don't know. Maybe I wasn't ready then myself mentally to take that on. But now I am. Because I don't want the next 10 years to be like the last. And I could see, I can see why it happens. I can see why there's those builders out there that have spent 20 years in the industry and just done the same thing. And some of them are part of my course. I think it's like that's what that's what they know. It becomes like a creature of habit. Get up, work hard, go to work, do this, okay, build this. Oh wow, we won an award. Oh, okay, start again, do it again. Let's win the next job, let's win two jobs, let's employ this person, let's fire that person. And it's just like groundhog day. That's all they are. But it how I think it can happen in any industry too. Doctor, surgeons. Surgeons might get paid half a million dollars a year, or a million bucks a year, depending on what you do. But it's like, okay, how many brains are you gonna operate on? Is that what you're gonna do for the next 50 years? Are you gonna employ Optimus from Tesla, from uh Elon? And he's gonna, you're gonna get buy a whole bunch of robots that are gonna do all the operations for you. Like, what is your play there? Are you still gonna do the same old thing? I think it's I think habits are a hard thing to break out of for some people. For a lot of people. Habits can be good and they can be bad too. Your habit could be I'm just gonna go home and eat chips tonight and pizza. Fuck, that would be good. I could smash a pizza. Yeah. How's your carnivore diet going, by the way?

Robby: 26:40

Me? Yeah. I've been doing carnival.

George: 26:41

I've sure.

Robby: 26:42

Huh.

unknown: 26:43

Cool.

George: 26:43

You? Yeah, it's gonna I'm I'm doing more paleo than carnivore, I think. So it's I'm still high protein, low carb, effectively, and I'm but I'm still having vegetables and fruit, but I'm noticing a difference. Yeah, good. Yeah, um yeah, no, I haven't been doing it at all. Okay. Um yeah, so I think the habit people fall into, and it's a it's very easy for me to get up every single when I say easy, like I get up six, five, six o'clock, come here, punch out the work, do what I need to do, go home, repeat, go to the gym, have meetings, meet an architect, do a deal, and so on and so forth.

Robby: 27:21

And so you don't want to fall back into I don't want to just fall into that habit.

George: 27:24

No. So what needs to happen for that to change for me? And arguably, builder elite was an element of that. That was a bit of a change. It was a completely new business, it was something different. I was going out there, making an impact, um, getting like I went on a podcast the other day. Uh, shout out to Jimmy, and I was surprised that he he's got a decent following on his page. And he had, there was a few comments that I was reading saying, Oh, I've been waiting for this podcast to happen. I've been waiting for you to get George on for su for ages. And there's quite a lot of people that were commenting on there saying, Oh, this is a great episode. I've been wanting to hear this. I've been wanting. So even as much as sometimes I think I'm not creating as much of an impact as I think I can or should or am, I actually am because people are seeing and understanding knowing who I am. There's people out there now in the construction space more than anything that know of me at the very least, and go, oh, yeah, I know that guy, I've heard of that guy, oh yeah, I've seen that guy. We're running heaps of ads at the moment. So my face is being seen all over Melbourne at the moment. Um, yeah, so like there's still plenty I do that's above the norm. But it's like again, excellence. That's what I want. That's what I want. Well, then it does take another level of thinking. It does take a challenging and fear and a whole range of emotions.

Robby: 28:46

So this all stemmed from me asking you what's missing.

George: 28:50

Yeah. I I so the thing that was missing, I think, is that I suppose two IC. Right, that second in con in charge, but eventually to make that person more of a one IC, first in charge. Because otherwise, I've have to be the operator. I have to do less and less. Like today, I was talking to my PA and we're talking, I'm like, cool, we've caught up with all XYZ in the business. She's like, Yep, cool. I say, great. We need to have the system in place so that you start taking things off my plate. So I don't need to do that. Don't put that on my desk. Don't even just do it. It's all yours now. I don't need to know about it. And then it's like, okay, we have a process for the team to do this. Send an email out to everyone today and say, guys, this is how you're going to do this from now on. Please run everything through me. Bang, that's one less thing I have to do. And I that's gonna be a core focus of mine is delegation this year.

Robby: 29:45

Letting other people handle Yeah.

George: 29:48

Because they can. And they'll probably do a really good job at it too, especially if I give them the freedom to do so.

Robby: 29:55

Yeah, business is a funny, funny old thing, isn't it?

George: 29:59

Yeah, look, it's it is exciting. It's great. I love winning. Yeah, winning's a great feeling, especially in business. Like today, walking into this room, I was looking at a package and I'm like, fuck, this is tough. This is this isn't working, and I can't make it stack, I can't make a balance. And then literally the conversation I walked in here, I'm like, all right, cool. We've probably just picked up 30 to 40 grand. Like, good win. Let's go. Let's go on to the next one now. And I'm already thinking, how can I use that money to go out and do more? Not, oh, let's go buy a new jet ski. Let's go get a new car, whatever it might be. It's like, no, no, where can I use those funds now to go and build a bigger brand, to go and invest in a development, whatever it is. Employ a new person, give someone a bonus. Like, what? What is the game? What is it? And I'm just gonna keep trying shit. All right, because we often ask ourselves, like, what are we what are we missing? What are we doing? Well, fuck, if we can't just keep thinking that, just try shit. Try it. Something might stick, something might be like, hey, that was fucking cool a few years ago. You're like, I'm gonna employ this sales company and see how that goes, like, gave it a crack. It didn't work out. Not to say sales doesn't work, or there's not companies out there that don't do it really well, but that particular thing didn't work. You gave it a go. You didn't just sit back and go, oh, that might work, or that could be nice.

Robby: 31:22

Yeah, yeah, I remember that.

George: 31:24

Um, what's the one thing like if you had to say like the most impactful or the biggest mistake that's cost you either time or I'll tell you, I'll tell you the biggest thing that I have done that's cost me the most amount of money is being too lenient on clients with payments.

Robby: 31:46

Clients, as in the person you're building for.

George: 31:49

Yep. That's been the biggest thing. Not keeping them accountable and and having them to that standard that we are about as well. And what I mean by that is it's like, okay, if a payment's late, there's consequences. Here's your fee, here's your notice, here's this, here's this. We're not a bank, we're your builder, pay on time. And it's like, you know, trying to do the right thing, especially at the very beginning, customers always right. You know, everyone knows that, everyone's trying to do that and do the right thing, but they're doing the wrong thing by you whilst you're trying to do the right thing. That's taking advantage of the situation. And it's like you don't pay your bills. Well, like you're scum. Like that, you're not why are you so entitled to think that you don't owe this money that you have signed a contract for? That was probably one of my that's the biggest lesson I learned over the years is like what is it? Trusting is good, no, knowing is good, checking is better, but uh just making sure that they are uh on the ball with it, like they get it and understand the consequences, and then just doing it, like you're not an asshole. They might think it for a little bit hey, you know the rules, you don't pay on time, there's consequences. I do I have to go out and get an overdraw on my business that cost me 10% because you don't pay me on time. Because, yeah, because you chose to change your mind about a particular element or sorry, uh, you know, sorry, I'm I'm my bank hasn't I didn't I forgot to send it to my bank. Fucking pay now. Get your credit card out, okay, pay the 2% fee for my invoice and pay for it. Like that's your problem. Why your problems, my problems? You know, I have these high standards for my employees, I have these high standards for my subcontractors and my and suppliers and everyone else in the business. Why not your clients? So that is a huge thing. And it's something that we, you know, now I'll sit down like this opposite a person. We're about to sign a deal, and it's the first thing I'll like we really reiterate. Make sure you pay us on time. It is one of your biggest and most important obligations for the successful delivery of this job. If you just pay us on time, that's all you have to do. Not all you have to do, but it's one of the core things you do. I promise you your job will go really, really well. And I've got a client, right? We're building a beautiful home for him at the moment. He is one of the best payers. He prompts me to pay him sometime for me to send him an invoice. And he's like, George, I just want to make sure you get paid. His job is moving so well as a result of the money always being there because the money comes in, I pay the trades. The trades get paid, they come back the next week and they keep working. Everything is there, ready to go. It's organized. The job is going really well. People enjoy going to the site because they're like, oh, we love working here. We know we get paid. We do a good job. We know that if we continue to do a good job, Pascal will give us more work. So it's such a huge, it has such a huge impact on the business, but also the particular individual project that it's it just makes everything go around. So that is my one biggest lesson. That's the biggest mistake. Whether you become too friendly with a client, you know, for you become that friend, that mate, you get in the friend zone with your client. It's fucked. Don't become friends that you're not friends with your clients. No, you need to not be friends with your clients. You need to have a professional relationship with them after you've built their home. If you want to have a relationship after that, by all means. But during construction, you are client-owner relationship. You can be friendly, yeah. You can talk, hey, I'm great to see your kid won the award on the weekend. Fantastic, you're right. But that's that's being friendly and like whatever and engaging. That's the only way to talk to life. Even if they don't have kids. But it's like there has to be a level of professionalism here because Amex, the day you don't, the next day you don't pay your Amex off, what happens? 27%. All right, just like that. You get your fee on the interest. Like it's bang. It's like, what's this for? Oh, well, you didn't pay us on time. A billion dollar company the next day. So why is it for you? Oh no, well, can we pay you next month? Can we pay you in three weeks? Can we pay you tomorrow? It's like, no, yes, you can, but here's your fee. Here's the bill. So that has to be that that was always something that needed to change for ourselves. And it did. And I the only way it changed was through my pain of clients not paying us at the end of a job because I'd never set the standard from the day one, and they thought they could walk all over us and not pay their final bills. And it's like, oh, fucking this whole chestnut. So yeah, very frustrating and very demoralizing as far as running your business is concerned because you work so hard on a build, you work so hard on the projects to get everything done, and it's like you you guys don't pay a bill.

Robby: 36:39

Like, what's wrong with you? Dan, there's no element of beforehand over, have all the cash.

George: 36:46

No. No, that's like as in the builder, have the cash before handover? Not depends on the space, but generally, no. You've got to finish defects 100%. You can like, okay, I've literally done that before. Whereas cool, we're not giving you, you don't get keys, you don't get the certificates, they just call the locksmith, change the locks, and moved in. What do you do? What do you do? The alternative, you go there with pitchforks and baseball bats. Cool, you go to jail. You know what I mean? Like, what are you gonna do in that instance? You go to so the the system's broken. System's broken, you go to court. Cool, spend two, a hundred, two hundred grand going to court. Go for it. Who wins? You're never gonna win everything. You might win some, you might win half. It's two years, three years worth of headaches. Like, it's the system's not set up in a way to do the right thing. It's there to be exploited and people exploit it. So that's why it's up to us at the very beginning of the job. Cool, you're late. Here's your fee, here's your speeding fine. Don't do the wrong thing again. And again, it's not you being an asshole, it's being it's you being a good business owner. That's what it comes down to.

Robby: 37:53

I can see how a lot of people would misinterpret.

George: 37:56

Oh, without a doubt. Without a doubt, they would. Oh, like what are you doing? Oh, we're only a week late and you're charging me, you know, four or five hundred dollars. Like, that's not very fair. Hang on, is it very fair that you haven't paid your bill and I have to now wear the interest of that? I have to pay this on my credit card and wear the fees, or I have to do that, or I have to have that unknowing of, well, are you paying? What if you go broke? What if I invert what if you what if you're three weeks late and in three weeks, in three weeks on a project, I could spend$300,000. And I if you had told me, if I knew you went broke on day one, if I kept, if I stopped working the day you didn't pay me, I would have saved myself an extra$300,000 because I wouldn't have done that work. And that happens. You know, people don't have the money, and then the builder just keeps building in the good faith that this person's gonna do the right thing, and then it fucks everyone. It fucks the builder, the subbies, the suppliers, anyone on that project. So, yeah, that was my biggest lesson in 10 years, is everyone's happy and pumped and really excited at the very at when you're signing a contract. But there are just it's such an emotional roller coaster and ride and pressure along the whole build that it's very rare that you get to an end of the end of the project and everyone still feels the same way. I built a lot of homes over and projects over the years. There's been less than a handful that are like that. Really? Yep. That's wild. Yeah. Because not many people are uh uh uh equipped to handle that emotional and financial pressure from the building from the client side. Yeah, yeah. They've never dealt with that figure of like that level of money before. Some have, like, because we're in that luxury space as well, we do some high end homes. A lot of my clientele are very successful and had to have a fair bit of money. But say you work and say you're building a family home for someone that have, you know. Mom and dad, they make a couple hundred grand a year, whatever it might be. They've got a loan, got some money behind them. Those types of people get very stressed. Oh, hey, there's a there's a variation here for this reason, completely out of my control. This is your cost. Oh, 10 grand. Like, where am I gonna find 10 grand now? Like, I can't do that. Another 10 grand here, oh this, this, this. It's a very stressful thing. You, you, as an individual, as a builder, haven't done the wrong thing. It's just like, no, no, this is a cost. Like, I can't wear this, I've never allowed for it. And we clearly said we don't allow for asbestos. Let's just say I found asbestos in the ground. Well, I haven't allowed for that. I now have to get rid of it because I can't build on top of it. I can't have my workers working around it. Here's$10,000. And it's like you become the villain as a result of their sight conditions. So it can, I can understand why it's a stressful process and period. But again, I've got to try. How do you how do you combat that? You try and vet that at the very beginning. I have these discussions. Hey, things come up. I've never built a home without a variation. I need you to understand that. Don't think we're going to get through this build and you are not going to spend more money than what you're signing. You probably will through changes that you make, through unforeseen things. But I won't ever come back to you. If I've missed something and I should have included it, you won't get an email from me. It's all right, cop it on the chin, move on to the next one. But I make enough money on the project that if that does happen, we're covered. We're good. You know, I don't go in on the skin of my teeth. And that's probably another thing I've learned over the years not to price things too low just to win a job. I learned that early in my career. You know, because that's a dangerous game too. When you're just making ends meet, that's a dangerous game to play in construction because it's a slippery, slippery slope. You can do that. That's the same in any business, I'm sure. When you're just making borderline margins, month to month. Yeah, it's not worth doing it. Go work for someone. No stress, and you can probably get a really well-paid job doing something else somewhere else.

Robby: 41:52

Yeah, and yeah, and you're leave and stuff.

George: 41:53

Yeah, and you're leave. What a life. What a life. So I've been talking a lot.

Robby: 41:59

Uh no, I think that's really interesting though. Like, obviously, you know, 10 years uh in a business, surviving 10 years all instantly puts you into, you know, yeah, the top 10%. Yeah, I think it's something I'm proud of.

George: 42:12

Like we've every project we've ever built, like I'm still very proud of them, like even the bad ones. It's in financially bad ones. Like, no, no, we did an excellent job. Well done. Tune up. But there's um, yeah, there's an element of you I don't want to say the word. Uh you need to have some mongrel in you.

Robby: 42:35

When it comes to the reckon that's the right word.

George: 42:37

I was gonna say the C bomb, but uh, yeah, champion.

Robby: 42:43

Yeah.

George: 42:43

You need to have some. Yes, you do. You need to be, I don't know, this is what it's like. This is how it is. Don't like it, too bad. Go get another builder.

Robby: 42:54

Yeah, uh yeah, yes and no.

George: 42:56

Yeah, I I and I'm more of the no in the sense of that's my personality. I'm I'm a genuinely I'm a genuine person. I genuinely care about you, I want to do the right thing, but you know, it's like just because I do the right, this is another lesson I've learned. Just because I do the right thing doesn't automatically mean they're gonna do the right thing. Yeah, I I think I've been burnt by that a lot of times.

Robby: 43:16

There's there's nothing wrong with holding people accountable.

George: 43:19

Yeah.

Robby: 43:20

Do you know what I mean? If you've agreed to do this thing, uh unless we've done something wrong by you, yes, unless we've done something wrong by you, like we've accounted for that. You know, I had um last year I had someone contact me and uh it's a funny situation, but long story short, the person called and he's like, Hey, can you just um let us out of the contract? And I said, No. And he's like, why not? And I said, Because we've accounted for that work. He's like, Yeah, but what happens if you just let us out? Nothing's gonna happen. And I said, Why the fuck is there a contract? There's a contract in place for a reason. You've agreed to this period of time, you can either have the work done or pay it out. Pay it out. Yeah, because you've gone out because we've gone and made business decisions based on those numbers. That's right. Okay, and and people don't get this. Ah, people don't get this. I don't get it at all. But I've also been burnt like that in the sense of similar situations, yeah. Or you're oh fuck, all right, fine. Like, what am I gonna say here? But it's like, no, no, like this is the deal. You sign the contract knowing this, you know what I mean? I didn't force you to sign the contract, yeah. That's it. You signed the contract knowing this, and now we're in this predicament because you changed your mind. Yeah, do you know what I mean? And it's look, I'm always on to and uh dude, I've been I've been cooked. I've had a lady who told me that she was getting domestically abused. Your problems are not my problems, bank accounts are frozen, and that you know she really needs the ads running, and I did. And then she went missing. Yeah, that she went missing on me.

George: 45:02

Remember that story.

Robby: 45:03

Yeah, she went missing on me after months.

George: 45:05

I knew that person too. Yeah, I removed her from Instagram. I would fuck you.

Robby: 45:09

Oh yeah, it's like, dude, and it's like that was at a point where the business was new and that money was that would that hurt me.

George: 45:14

Yeah, but it wasn't just that, it's also that person was benefiting from your services. Yeah, they made money off what you did and then didn't pay you for it. That's what's fucked about that. Yeah, yeah.

Robby: 45:26

Um but but holding people accountable to it, I've got no I've got no remote. I will help you. If I can help you and I genuinely think you need help, I will help you.

George: 45:35

Yeah, even for me, it's going above and beyond.

Robby: 45:37

Yeah, but I will also not put myself into a position to get burnt again.

George: 45:41

Yeah, and I'm in a I'm in that position right now, actually. So I've got uh we'll tread carefully, I've got a contractor that wants to similar, pull out of a contract. And it's like we've got a couple of contracts with him, and I've said, okay, one, it's at a level where I'm comfortable to let you walk away. But this one, I've got another job, say, oi, there's a big problem here. You're trying to leave me in the lurch now. And again, we have subcontract agreements in place for this exact reason. This person's trying to walk out of the, he goes, Oh, I'm just I'm done. I'm cooked. I can't, I can't do this anymore. I said, Oi, it doesn't work like that. I've I've set up the whole thing. What do you mean? What do you mean I've cooked? The person? Yeah. Oh, I don't know the full story, as in I can only see what I can see. The person's either just doesn't want to be in business anymore and he's gonna go out and get a job, a P A Y G job. So he's effectively shutting down his business. Yeah, but his business is still in operation. It's just he's not trading anymore. He's gonna go get a job. All right.

Robby: 46:36

So wait, hold on. So is it in operation or it's not?

George: 46:39

I don't know. Like I'm this is what he's telling me. He's just telling me I'm gonna go get a job. I can't afford to keep working anymore. I said, oi, you're 80% through a build. I've paid you 80% of the money. Now I have to go out and get another trade to finish your job. It's not gonna cost 20% to finish the job. It's probably gonna cost an extra 40 to 50%. You're paying for that. Figure it out. Like, figure it out, mate. Like, I'll I want my preference is for you to do the job so we can move on. Now he's either cooked the books and he's really in the red, or he's genuinely getting a job somewhere else. But the fact that your circumstances change have nothing to do with me. We have a contractual obligation. Why should I now be penalized 30, 40 grand because you can't be fucked finishing it, or because you've made a mistake, or because you don't want to work hard anymore, or because this is tough. I don't care, mate. Sell your house, sell a kidney, sell your cars, whatever the fuck you got to do, sort your issues out.

Robby: 47:35

Sell the kidney.

George: 47:35

That's it. See what you're gonna do. But mate, you're like, go get a loan. Go get a loan. Let's say you put them on your credit card. Yeah. I don't care. I agree. I agree. I actually don't, and this isn't, and again, I I've said, I said, look, I don't want to be an asshole here, man. Like, I don't want to go down this path. All right. But you have an obligation here. We've done you've committed to doing the job. I haven't, I didn't hold a gun to your head and say, do it for this price. You gave the price. I didn't even negotiate you down. I said, Yeah, cool, let's go. He's done work for me in the past. So he's proven that he can deliver. But now his circumstances have changed. Well, mate, your problems are not my problems. So it's either going to get to a point now where it's like, okay, great, well done. You'll come and finish. Or and I said to him, I said, hey, if I find someone to do it for the same pro for whatever money's left, like, happy days. I fucking see you later. Yeah, yeah. I've got budgets, they need to be met. Yeah. And even, dude, even if it was like four or five grand, like whatever, fuck off. Don't call, like, delete my number. All right. Yeah. I'm not going to lose sleep. But if we're talking 10, 20, 30, 40 grand difference, hey, you've got a problem. Not me. I have the problem now because I'm going to have to forecast, I'm going to have to pay for that money, all right, in the interim. But dude, you're never going to talk to me again. My solicitor will talk to you and we'll win because it's black and white. He's a like they're abandoned. You've got a contract, they've abandoned the contract. Yeah. We're up for the costs. Have fun. And that's a lot worse road to go down for that person. But regardless, anyway, like I was like, just do the job. Just do the job. It's gonna is it hard? How can I help you? I'll help you, man. What do you do you need an extra? I'll give you my laborer to help you carry bags of sand. Like, what the fuck do you need? I'll help you. What do you want? Do you want me to pay for materials up front so you don't have to um what's it called? Finance it. I'll pay for it. Come and install. Like, what do you need? Yeah, this project has to move forward. That has to move forward. And I'm not gonna sit here now and again worry about all of that. I need to make decisions. But this again has come back. The the George in the past would have been like, oh, all right, I'll see if I can find another plumber and all right, it's gonna cost me 15 grand. Oh, fuck, all right. Like, no, not anymore. Done. That guy's dead.

Robby: 49:53

It's interesting, isn't it?

George: 49:54

Yeah. It is. It's gonna stem across all factors, not just clients. Like, because hey, like we're we're just reiterate, guys, there's been some magical moments running a business too. Yeah, there's been some fantastic times that we've had. But this episode's specifically about the challenges and the mistakes that we've made and the things that we would do differently, because I hope that this pulls on the strings of some people and goes, all right, I need to make sure I do that too, or make sure I need to cover that. Do you know what I would do differently?

Robby: 50:25

I would never start a business again.

George: 50:28

You'd buy one? Yeah, that's interesting.

Robby: 50:30

Yeah.

George: 50:31

But again, you know, you do that now. Yeah. Knowing what you know and everything you've done.

Robby: 50:37

Of course. Making a decision with the my brain, right?

George: 50:40

That's right. Your brain, when you started a business, would never have had the power to comprehend what it was going to be like to okay, I'm going to buy that business, but then once I've got that business, how do I get it to here?

unknown: 50:50

Yeah.

George: 50:51

Like you need you kind of needed those runs on the boards too.

Robby: 50:54

Yeah, yeah. It's one of those things of like, okay, the way it's like that with anything. Anything you look at in hindsight, it's like, well, the thing that you did is the thing that got you here. Therefore, you saying you wouldn't do that thing again doesn't make any sense because you wouldn't be the person you are. Yeah, yeah. Um, but I I wouldn't start a business from scratch again. I I feel like you know, I feel like I've spent so much time building systems and processes. And I just feel like some of them have been so basic, and I'm like, you know what, man, like I probably could have inherited this stuff.

SPEAKER_01: 51:28

Yeah.

Robby: 51:29

Probably didn't have to go and work out what systems we need and what programs we need and go, like, you know what I mean? It's like that's a lot of time spent. Yeah. You know, and then it's like, how long were you operating for before that came in too? Like your first year of business, you don't have any of that. You don't know what the fuck's going on. You're just scraping everything you can to you've got a skill set, you're like a contractor initially. You're like, I know I've got this skill set, I know how to deliver on this thing. I have like limited business knowledge. Yeah, I mean, and then you fucking learn all the other elements, and then you start like, and when I say limited business knowledge, okay, you can market, but you don't understand finance, you don't understand your numbers, you don't understand tax, you don't understand everything. Yeah, it's like payment uh how we okay.

George: 52:17

I don't even know, I didn't even know what P-A-Y-G was. Page? Yeah, page, that's it. I didn't even know, like I didn't understand Bass when I first started. Yeah, I didn't understand um like how super worked, I didn't understand any of that shit. I learnt it as I went. Now imagine you could have someone sitting down, hey, that would be a good book. To the the basics, yeah, like business 101.

Robby: 52:41

That would be a great book. There you go. Something you could start. You know, saying that'd be a great small business. It'd be a great course. Yeah, like imagine sitting through a program and they just taught you about, you know, different structures, companies, PLs, you know, how to actually read a PL. Yeah, how to how to understand a balance sheet, how to look at a cash flow statement, how to make forecasts and predictions, sales processes, like how to just get the most basic sales process into your business. Yeah, you know what I mean? How to build uh well marketing, how it works, lead generation, do you know what I mean? How your business actually fucking operates. Like imagine someone gave you all that, and it's like I've built most of that from scratch.

SPEAKER_01: 53:27

Yeah.

Robby: 53:28

And then I look at that and I think most of the stuff, like, there's some really cool stuff in there that I'm proud of, but like most of the stuff I'm like, I probably didn't have to do this. Yeah, I had to do it now because it didn't exist.

George: 53:38

Yeah, and you need it.

Robby: 53:39

But it's like you probably could have, had you inherited the business, you probably would have saved the year.

George: 53:44

Provided that the person within that business was like that as well. Because a lot of these business owners' business, yeah, that's right. A lot of these business owners don't.

Robby: 53:51

Usually if a business is stuck around for like five years, it's gonna have most of that shit. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? If you buy a business that's seven or eight years old, it's gonna have a large portion of those things, it's gonna have a finance system, it's gonna have, you know what I mean, at some level of process.

George: 54:04

Yeah, here's the other thing as well that I've noticed over the years is systems are great. Actually, systems are a core, like you have to have them. You cannot operate efficiently without your systems, without your processes. But a system is only as good as its end user. And I've had systems in the past as early, as recent as last year. So I had people not using the systems, and it was like it was pissing me off to the extent that I was like, hey, I'm gonna fucking fire you. Like, yeah, I'll use this, like yeah, yeah. And I think it was you said it actually. I think we were talking one day, and you're like, this person didn't do this thing on one day and I lost it. It was like a check-in or a me. Yeah, like something they didn't fill out something at the end of the day. Do you do something like that? End of day reports, end of day report, was it or a start of day report? I don't know. What did you do? Do you have something in place? Yeah, so that's right. It was signing in. So people and they didn't do it once, like just once, and you're like, hey, what the fuck? Yeah, this I pull up. Do that, pull people up.

Robby: 55:06

Pull people up straight away. I don't let it, because why let it, why let it fester? Yeah, that's right. Because human nature, you this like and not it's got nothing to do with the other person. Yeah, it's human nature that if they kind of get away with it once, they'll do it again and again.

George: 55:19

And that's exactly what was happening. And we were using this system where it's like, I want people to use this every day, like doing it. It was a site diary. Like, you have to do your site diary, it's non-negotiable. You have to take photos of the site every single day, it's not negotiable. Okay. The same way I employ you to hammer a nail into the like if I employed you as a carpenter to build walls and you didn't fucking build walls, yeah. Why are you here?

Robby: 55:48

You want to be employed?

George: 55:49

Why are you here? Dude, yeah. It is part of their role. And it got to the point where it's like I said, hey, like, don't this is a mandatory thing of your role. If you don't do it, your employment will be very short-lived. I had to get to that point. I said, this is not negotiable, guys. Like, you have to do this. So that's just one thing with that particular thing, but it's also across the board. Like, if you're if you have, it's all good and dandy to have great systems, but if your people aren't using them properly, there's fucking, you may as well not have anything there. You may as well not have anything there. So that's another thing I'm tightening up on this year is really honing in on the processes and the systems. Did something happen today? Oh, so one of like I got this document in, we got this whole process that whenever we get updated drawings, there's a process to make sure they get distributed properly. And I got something in and I'm like, I wonder if this has been saved already. So I went into the system, checked, and blah, blah, blah, and it was all set up and it was all done. I was like, fantastic. So that just shows the system works. That just shows the person that was responsible for that system understood it, did it promptly, and everything was as it should be. Yeah. I'm like, fantastic. Like I was big tick. So yeah, great to have systems. It's even better when people are using them as they should.

Robby: 57:05

Yeah, but you know what I've learned as well more recently? You can set up systems to the to the and I I got this from a client and he kind of pushed me on something. And we do some some work with them, and he's like, We do work with them, but they do the work, if that makes sense. So and he pushed me on this thing and he's like, We gotta do posting. He's like, make it 6 30. I was like, right between six and seven. He's like, no, six thirty. He goes, because if I tell him between six and seven, it'll always be seven. It's always gonna be five. Yeah, or it's gonna be just outside, or he's like, I want no room for error. He's like, I want it to be bang on. Do you know what I mean? Like, there's no reason this shouldn't get done on this time at this day. Yeah, it's not a if you leave it open for interpretation, it's like leave nothing open for interpretation, dude. How does McDonald's get 15-year-olds to make your burger and taste the same as if an adult made it most of the time?

George: 57:56

Man, I look, I went to Disneyland the other day. There was half a half a million people there. Like easily, easily half a million people. And it's like that's a lot of people. That's a lot of fucking people. And although I complained a little bit about the fast track and lane and all that situation. Hey, you complained deeps. They like that I was upset. I was upset. They made it work though. The systems worked, everything, everyone was happy, everyone got their things, everyone got what they wanted out of the experience because they had that process and that system. It's a well-oiled machine. They got everything done. And I completely agree with that. And you know, one thing that really runs through my head as as of late last year, but now predominantly now, uh, in 26, is don't leave anything to chance why why leave it to chance? That's my that's what I always ask myself now. And that came from Alex Ormozi, and it was you actually told me of that. He's like looking at his ad campaign, looking at how he runs everything, he's like, we did half a dozen ads for previous events. You know, I'd give you some here, I'd give you some, hey, sit down for an hour, film a hundred ads, go. Like, why leave it to chance? Just fucking do it. So now I look at it from the perspective of I kind of just asked myself that question. I said, Oh, could do that. Hey, why leave it to chance? Why leave it to chance? Why should I have an inkling of this not working? Why should I have a percentage that this will do really well or won't do really well? Like, get rid of those other options and make it fucking happen.

Robby: 59:27

And ask yourself the question of like, if my whole life depended on this thing getting done, what would I do to make sure it gets done?

unknown: 59:33

Yeah.

Robby: 59:34

Like, what's the thing? If my whole life depended on this person doing this thing, yeah, what would I do? What's everything I would do to make sure that person does it? Yeah. How would I just would I just write one sentence or would I give them a full description of what needs to be done?

George: 59:46

Would I have photos on it? Would I, yeah. Would I do a video? Would I write it?

Robby: 59:49

Make sure there's instructions, but I make sure they have everything they need so that there's no way for them to fuck this up because I don't want to.

George: 59:56

You're gonna go through all these things and you go, okay, great. This is well. Then this is what we have to do. This is exactly how it has to work and play out.

Robby: 1:00:03

I reckon a um starting for business program would be.

George: 1:00:09

Yeah, I think it'd be very beneficial for people that are that are doing that. But I suppose the Is that what they teach you in uni?

Robby: 1:00:15

Is that what they teach you in uni?

George: 1:00:17

Me? When I went to uni? What did you do in uni? I did construction management.

Robby: 1:00:21

Oh, you didn't do business.

George: 1:00:22

No. Okay. But even I'd like to know what they learn in business because in all honesty, I don't even you're getting lecturers. Like you're not getting business owners teaching fucking business.

Robby: 1:00:31

If they gotta teach something that's something, there's entrepreneurship as well.

George: 1:00:35

Yeah, that what a fucking stupid course that is. Is it entrepreneurship?

unknown: 1:00:40

What?

George: 1:00:41

How to wing it? Yeah, exactly. You know what I mean? Um it's like no part of being an entrepreneur is you exactly that, just winging it and going out there and having an idea, and they're trying to teach people how to be book smart. And it's like, what type of management style do you use? Laissez faire, or there is one called that. Or uh you know, are you gonna be authoritarian? Are you gonna be whatever it's gonna be? So it's like there that's the shit they're teaching in business classes, right? It's like, no, get a fucking person that's turned over a hundred million dollars in their business and go, hey, stop fucking around, this is what you need to do. But that person's never gonna go and lecture at a unit.

Robby: 1:01:16

It's different. I've got a guy that works with us and he's got a master's degree in marketing. Something like I don't know. I don't know the difference between a master's and a I don't know and a bachelor. Yeah, but he's got a degree, a marketing degree. Yeah, okay. He did four years or whatever. I asked, he's been on first formester yeah. I said, question your marketing degree. He's like, Yeah. I was like, what did you do there in four years that you do today that you like that's helped you do today? And he's like, nothing. Yeah. And I said, so nothing you learn in that four years you do for your job. And he's like, nah. He's like, I've learned way more here.

George: 1:01:56

Yeah. And I'm like, that's wild. What a great um, such a great example.

Robby: 1:02:02

Wild. Fucking my thing, hey, I was trying to pick his brain. I'm like, hey, yeah, give me the good stuff.

George: 1:02:07

You're a master. Give me the good stuff, yeah.

Robby: 1:02:10

You spend four fucking name. You spent four years.

George: 1:02:13

You're so you're bang on. You are 100% bang on. And this is why I say when I I did so when I went to uni, I went to TAFE first. I did two years in TAFE. So I did a diploma of building, and then I transferred to third year construction management degree, so third and fourth year. TAFE? Yeah, I did TAFE first. So which TAFE? RMIT. So I was RMIT TAFE and then RMIT Uni. Same campus? Uh, different buildings, but same area. Yeah. So the TAFE course back then was actually taught by builders, by extradies, by that's who the lecturers, that's who the people teaching are. I know, I know a builder that it was yeah, there you go. It was a very practical course. Like I actually learnt a lot in those first two years because they were teaching us stuff. We would go out to a construction site and they would say, Hey, remember that thing I drew on the wall and showed you how this stud works and this wall works? This is that detail. Oh wow. So you did you do four years? It was two years in the diploma, and then at the time, because those the two courses were very similar, we transferred into straight straight into third year, whereas a lot of unis do it, you get into second year, not third year.

Robby: 1:03:20

Isn't that um okay? If I said to you, if I said to you, George, teach me. Like for real, teach me. We're gonna I'm gonna enjoy your business, we're gonna be a builder. I need you to teach me. Yeah, honestly, now how long do you reckon you need with me?

George: 1:03:36

Oh, I reckon in two years you'd be a fucking gun.

Robby: 1:03:38

Two years?

George: 1:03:39

Yeah, come on, man. All right, I'll give you one and a half, huh? One and a half.

Robby: 1:03:44

You reckon it'll take me that long to get off the ground.

George: 1:03:47

Let's see. No, no, what do you want to do? Like on site or in the office?

Robby: 1:03:50

Whatever.

George: 1:03:51

Okay, I reckon from an office perspective, you with your skill set and knowledge base as you are today, I reckon in six to eight months, you'll know a lot. Eight weeks, eight weeks, eight weeks, tops, yeah.

Robby: 1:04:05

Eight weeks, and I'll be what I'll pay you more. I'll be I'll pay you.

George: 1:04:08

Don't even look for good people. I told you I want to step away from doing shit that I I want people I trust. I reckon uh someone's GM roll is up.

Robby: 1:04:16

Someone you and Simon to fight it. Yeah, Simon put them up. Um, I reckon if someone joined me and had no like zero experience, I reckon after four to six weeks of I'll just hammer them, they would get off the ground. They'd still make mistakes, yeah, all that jobs like that. But like I'll get them off the ground.

George: 1:04:38

Oh, look, I'm saying for you to be competently good at what you're doing.

Robby: 1:04:41

I reckon I'm competent now.

George: 1:04:42

Shit. That's a builder.

Robby: 1:04:44

I'm gonna build a pagola. You did you borrowed my trailer. Yeah. Built a pigola. Send you the invoice. Great pagola, thank you. Um send it to Sam in accounts.

George: 1:04:55

Yeah. Um, yes, I was saying I did the two-year diploma, which was great because it was very practical, taught by people there. When I transferred into the degree, it was all about management styles and fucking So it wasn't practical. It was, you know, they had some they we did this one course. I remember actually now you bring out memories. It was structural mathematics. So they wanted me to learn, like we had to learn how the formula to do the bend in a beam in a structural beam because of the load coming on it and all that sort of shit. We had to learn that. And I'm like, hey, I literally said to the lecturer, I said, Can I be can I ask you a question? And he's like, it might be dumb. Don't we employ engineers to do this? And he's like, Yes. Okay, so an engineer will design this, we'll do everything, we'll do it. Why do I need to learn the load, the newton meters, the this, the kilowatts, the fucking why do I need to know that? It's like, oh, you need to have an understanding of it.

Robby: 1:05:50

That's fair, that's fair. I I agree to some degree. I don't know if you need to know the maths.

George: 1:05:55

The maths, yeah, it wasn't the concept of having low, it was the actual mathematical formula that we had to figure out. It was algebra. And you know what even pissed me off at the end when we did our test? He just gave us the answers. Did he? Yeah. It was like, oh, everyone, if you look on page six, you might find what you're looking for. And it's like everyone's like, so ask me what I've learned, and what I've never done that formula ever again in my life.

Robby: 1:06:23

And the best part is if you had those dimensions, you would just type it into chat.

George: 1:06:26

Exactly. And it would spit out now. Now it would. Now I would. Long story short, similar to your mate, similar to your mate. Oh, sorry, to your employee. I can't tell you one thing that I learned in those two years at the degree that I would use today. Not one thing. Whereas the diploma was actually, I thought it was a fantastic course back then. I don't know what it's like now. But those two years of doing degree, fucking stupid. It got me the it got me a certificate that got me the job. That's what it was.

Robby: 1:06:55

Which got you the experience?

George: 1:06:58

Which had I, and if I'm going to go back early days before I even started my company, if I was studying and I was talking to my 18-year-old self from now, I'd said, hey, stop fucking around, go and get a job at a shit kicker job, doing whatever you're gonna do at a building company, you will learn so much more. Just from being on site. Just from being on site, even though being in the office. Yeah. Start off as the laborer, get in the office, start reading plans. Because I guarantee, if I in my third year, if I went and worked for say a multiplex, because they did take undergrads back then, I'm sure they do now too. But say I worked at a tier one construction company, man, I would have just mopped the floor with everyone at uni. I would have learned so much, so much. So my advice to any youngster out there is go out and get a job as fast as humanly possible, working for someone somewhere.

Robby: 1:07:47

I think the world needs a book on um.

George: 1:07:50

Why are you looking at me?

Robby: 1:07:51

I'm just I don't know. You look like you're due to write a book, bro. You look like you're ready to write a book.

George: 1:07:57

I'm ready. And I'm going to. Maybe I will one day. Who knows? It won't need and it won't, I won't even use chat. I'll use chat for everything.

Robby: 1:08:04

You got 20 years at all. 20 plus years experience. You're um hey, I'm teaching people now.

George: 1:08:10

Well uh it'll fit well within the universe of what I'm doing at the moment. Write a book. I will, I relax. I've got other shit to do as well. Write a book. Come on, man. Hey, do you have a pen and paper? This could be sick. Um write a book, write a book. Will you give away a copy on this podcast?

Robby: 1:08:26

Yeah, we might give away a copy.

George: 1:08:28

Only if someone com if someone sends us a message anywhere on any platform after listening to this podcast about and says, hey, write a book, I'll write a book. Okay. You heard it here. It's at the very end. I'll write it. You tell me if I get one, just one message, it could be you. You might think, ah, someone's already sent it. They haven't.

Robby: 1:08:46

Yeah.

George: 1:08:46

You stop what you're doing, pull over. If you're listening to this in your car, if you're walking your dog and you got your AirPods plugged in, yeah. Get your phone out of your pocket.

Robby: 1:08:53

If you send it, it will send you a free book.

George: 1:08:55

We'll send you, you'll you'll send it like it's me. You'll get episode one. You'll get a free book. You'll get the the very first copy.

Robby: 1:09:01

Yeah, you'll get a free book, free book just for telling George to write a book.

George: 1:09:05

And it'll be the number one, it'll be worth heaps because it's gonna go as a New York bestseller.

Robby: 1:09:10

New York Times bestseller.

George: 1:09:12

That's it, it's gonna go top of the charts.

Robby: 1:09:13

How can you buy that title? Really?

George: 1:09:15

Yeah, doesn't surprise me.

Robby: 1:09:17

So the whole world. Can you imagine it? Anyway, well, that's that. So if you're uh if you've made some mistakes in business, uh don't feel too bad. Well, don't feel sorry for yourself. I think everyone's it's all part of the game, it's all part of learning. You know, people say business is a vehicle for personal development, and I think it's one of the greatest ways that you can learn and develop as a human. Because the reality is, man, like when you're a business owner and you have all those stresses and all that jazz, you form so much more than a person who's just an employee.

George: 1:09:46

I couldn't agree more.

Robby: 1:09:47

What a great and there is employees who excel in their career and learn a lot, and that's great too. Yeah, but most don't. And but most business owners learn enough. Most I say most because some are cooked, but most learn enough to be able to get to that next level. So business is the vehicle to be able to get you there. Any final remarks, George?

George: 1:10:08

My word. Um learn from this podcast. Learn from this podcast, learn from this podcast, and look at areas now that you could just try and think outside the box. If you're just starting out, just go cool. Like, what don't I know? What am I not good at? Just have a really honest conversation with yourself. So, what am I not good at? What could I be doing better? What do I need to be doing? I'll tell you what you could be doing if you are in construction, and that's getting to the Builder Summit. Because we have the Builder Summit coming up next month on the 25th of February. It's going to be in Melbourne at Mulvern Town Hall. And if you are serious about growing your construction business and learning the things that you don't know that you should know, then you've got to be in rooms like this. You've got to be surrounded by people who are also willing and wanting to learn, but then you also have to come and learn from the very best. And I am the very best. And so is Robbie. Number one builder in Australia. You can go and check the charts right now. It's New York as well. In New York. New York Times. Just in New York and Australia. I'm the very best. But uh, and look, Robbie's gonna be there too. Robbie is gonna be there, and he's gonna be teaching you the very best about marketing, branding, and AI. Because I also checked the charts this morning. And you're number one in that area too.

Robby: 1:11:30

Paid for the top spot.

George: 1:11:32

It's like an ad. Well, there, you should learn something about that. Um, yeah, get there.

Robby: 1:11:37

Free tickets, free tickets, limited seats. Yeah, I've heard it's gonna be the biggest one.

George: 1:11:41

Oh man, it's so pumped.

Robby: 1:11:42

This is what I'm hearing.

George: 1:11:43

It's gonna be good. It's gonna be good.

Robby: 1:11:45

But you'll uh you'll only know if you're there. That's right. So save your seat. Save your seat.

George: 1:11:50

Click the link wherever it is. Go on the website, go on the social media platforms, you guys will be able to figure it out. Send us a message.

Robby: 1:11:57

Send us a message, we'll send you a link.

George: 1:11:58

Yeah, even better. Do something. Do something and um subscribe.

Robby: 1:12:02

Yeah, subscribe to the channel. Thanks for listening. We hope your 2026 is off to a great start, and we'll see you on the next one.

George: 1:12:11

You sure will.

Robby: 1:12:12

Thanks, guys. Thanks, everyone.